Thursday, 20 May 2010

the need for discipline

D is very reluctant about the idea of any real sort of discipline or correction or punishment or whatever you want to call it.
i feel like it's something i need to truly feel 'submitted' - like the fact of consequences actually make me feel more safe in being owned/controlled. i'm really struggling to explain myself properly to D though and He seems to interpret what i'm saying as asking for the actual punishment which is most definitely not what i mean. 


i'm wondering if anyone could help out with an explanation of why they feel they need this in their dynamic (to those of you who do)? Dom and sub views would be most welcome.


Please comment below and/or put up your own post on the topic - Thanks!!

6 comments:

  1. Well, for me...It's not so much about submission as it is the feeling that I can't move passed something. It's like I become stuck on whatever it is I did wrong. I mean the truth is I'm harder on myself than O is. Sometimes when I'm punished for something, instead of bringing me down it helps me move beyond whatever it was I did.

    Hugs,
    mouse

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  2. Oh and something else...punishment doesn't, in my opinion, correct all behavior, but it does create clear boundaries.

    hugs again,
    mouse

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  3. It's not asking for the punishment, but rather the structure and accountability to achieve real change. Maybe approach it more from the goal side of things. Like... "I really need help/motivation to do such and such" ... instead of a focus on the punishment and/or the feelings associated with it (feel safe, etc).

    We do know what you're saying about those feelings though. Someone cares enough to watch and hold me accountable through real consequences... it is powerful. Certainly other aspects to it though, including the actual help in changing a behavior or reaching a goal. Sometimes for the spanker that aspect... helping motivate change... is the larger focus too. That's especially true in more intense relationships in which they deep down feel that perhaps you should "already feel safe."

    :)
    Suzy and Todd
    americanspankingsociety.com

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  4. i need it, too. Consequences, that is, not necessarily punishment. i've only been punished once by Master.

    If there aren't any consequences to my behaviour, i lose focus and keep pushing to try to find a limit. i can be self-destructive in the quest to find somebody who will actually push me back.

    Master is learning to understand this, and to feel it intuitively. Hopefully your D will learn these aspects of your needs are counter-intuitive, too.

    -r.

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  5. One of the major aspects of a D/s relationship is that control is passed between two people, from the s to the D. It sounds as if you feel that the punishment dynamic would kind of help define precisely the level, and the kinds, of control that he wants. Otherwise it can feel as if you are floundering without the structure of accountability. That's kind of one of those inherent characteristics of many, many submissives - the need for accountibility. It helps keep us focused as others have said, and it also helps give us a sense of control, even when we feel our own control slipping.

    Or that's how it is for me at least. i know that, if i slip up and screw up, there will be consequences for that - which is kind of how we view it rather than punishment even if we *call* it punishment. For any negative behavior there are consequences, and if there are rules in your relationship, or expectations in terms of behaviors, and you fail....what consequences are there? It's also a form of discipline, when many, many submissives lack self discipline - *raises hand*.

    So, for us, it works well to have rules in place, and consequences if rules are broken. And i need that structure in place, although i honestly can't tell you the last time i faced such consequences. It isn't about wanting punishment, it is about wanting the knowledge that punishment will happen IF you screw up.

    The security of knowing what is expected of you is greatly enhanced by the added security that there WILL be consequences if those expectations aren't met.

    Or that's how it is for me at least. :)

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  6. To my submissive wife, submission is a crucial dimension in our relationship. Rules, and their enforcement, are thus important – both intrinsically, as a way to underline her obligation to obey, and as an instrument to promote behavioural change as an element of submission. Transgressions lead to punishment points; each point representing ten swats on either side with an implement, ten with the hand, and one with the cane. More points are associated with rules that I deem more crucial to either submission or surrender during play. When I feel a particular issue really needs be resolved, I may temporarily increase the number of points associated with it, or even connect to it a multiplication factor for all credit points. In O/our experience, this system both leads to behavioural change, especially on points I deem crucial and, more directly, in and of itself contributes part of the D-s dynamic. In addition, part of the rules concern making written assignments that help her deepen her submission, another indirect effect.

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